Another nail in the coffin of the Iberian Irish myth
Within the last few months, the genetic genealogy community has placed a new SNP (L21 / rs11799226) on the Y chromosome phylogenetic tree downstream of the most frequent western European haplogroup (R1b). Preliminary results suggest the overwhelming majority of Irish R1b carry the mutation, while L21 is absent in the Iberian samples and subclades tested so far. R1b from England and continental northwestern Europe seem to be split between L21-derived and L21-ancestral. It's still early and I'd like to see more data, but I think L21 (and thus the direct male ancestor of the majority of the Irish) most likely originated in northwestern Europe. The supposed link between the Irish and Iberians was built on the high frequency of R1b Y-DNA in both regions. The autosomal and mtDNA data never supported any sort of special or close relationship between "Celts" and Basques; it's now clear that Y-DNA doesn't, either.
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6 comments:
So how related are they to the English? What accounts for their relative lack of development? Linguistic difference? If Irish are NWE, why do they vary so much from other NWEs?
The Irish have more pressing matters to worry about than their European ranking.
The Republic of Ireland in particular has seen large-scale immigration. The 2006 census recorded that 420,000 foreign nationals, or about 10% of the population, lived in the Republic of Ireland. Chinese and Nigerians, along with people from other African countries, have accounted for a large proportion of the non–European Union migrants to Ireland.
The question was for n/a. Most foreigners are Poles and other EEs. The Nigerian component troublesome, but nothing compared to other countries. I know the ranking, I want to know why it is like that. The 'Iberian' story is the one most people think of, so if it's a myth I'd like to know why. Thanks.
The question is a bit absurd. They don't "vary so much" from other NW Europeans and it's not "if they're NWE," they are. In fact they're one of the most racially pure European groups.
They vary quite a bit in intellectual acheivement, especially compared to any other NWE group. I'd like to know how much of that is genetic (and perhaps what factors cause that discrepancy) and how much is cultural. IS there enough existing data to provide a solid answer? Most of the time I hear about DNA studies of the Irish, there is too much sampling from the East, and not enough from the South, West and North. So, I don't know, hence the question.
"So how related are they to the English? What accounts for their relative lack of development? Linguistic difference? If Irish are NWE, why do they vary so much from other NWEs?"
In MDS plots and the like, the Irish define the extreme northwestern pole of Europe, exactly as we might expect based on geography. The British tend to be intermediate between the Irish and Germans/French.
Lynn and others have reported lower IQ for the Irish compared to the English. I won't speculate on how much of any gap might be attributable to genetics, but relatively closely related groups, if exposed to different selective regimes for many generations, could certainly come to differ in intelligence and personality.
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